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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Praetorian View Post
    I've never seen any proof of Leydig cell issues with running hcg a couple times per week while on cycle. Some HRT docs actually use this method long term. I dont prescribe to using it while on but I know many do...I have just been very successfull with running PCT at the end and using HCG with it. Ive tried both methods and didnt see any difference in recovery time.
    P
    I wish I still had access to the reports, but I don't even remember the website, let alone the passwords, but they were all peer reviewed medical journals. The damage isn't something you would "notice". The reports referred more to a sterilization damage, sperm count etc. The only way you'd know if you had an issue would be to get a sperm count done I guess. I'm sure low dose hcg use for 3-4 month cycles would not produce any problems, the articles referred more to long term HRT with weekly HCG usage throughout. There was nothing in any article to do with AAS usage like we'd do because they are not legally allowed to perform those research studies. Only prescribed HRT trials could be monitored.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigGuns21 View Post
    I wish I still had access to the reports, but I don't even remember the website, let alone the passwords, but they were all peer reviewed medical journals. The damage isn't something you would "notice". The reports referred more to a sterilization damage, sperm count etc. The only way you'd know if you had an issue would be to get a sperm count done I guess. I'm sure low dose hcg use for 3-4 month cycles would not produce any problems, the articles referred more to long term HRT with weekly HCG usage throughout. There was nothing in any article to do with AAS usage like we'd do because they are not legally allowed to perform those research studies. Only prescribed HRT trials could be monitored.
    I dont prescribe to the weekly use of hcg myself... while on anyway..,but I dont see it causing an issue really..not at such a low dose and infrequently and for 3-4 months..long term possibly yes...but that would generally be hrt patient only. I dont see it keeping the testes working while exogenous test in in your system....the negative feedback loop is still strong.
    Ive tried both methods and to be honest HCG at the end with PCT IMO works the best...once OFF...it also makes more sense.
    P
    Last edited by Praetorian; 15-09-2010 at 01:28 PM.
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  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Praetorian View Post
    I dont prescribe to the weekly use of hcg myself... while on anyway..,but I dont see it causing an issue really..not at such a low dose and infrequently and for 3-4 months..long term possibly yes...but that would generally be hrt patient only. I dont see it keeping the testes working while exogenous test in in your system....the negative feedback loop is still strong.
    Ive tried both methods and to be honest HCG at the end with PCT IMO works the best...once OFF...it also makes more sense.
    P
    Totally Agreed.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Praetorian View Post
    I dont prescribe to the weekly use of hcg myself... while on anyway..,but I dont see it causing an issue really..not at such a low dose and infrequently and for 3-4 months..long term possibly yes...but that would generally be hrt patient only. I dont see it keeping the testes working while exogenous test in in your system....the negative feedback loop is still strong.
    Ive tried both methods and to be honest HCG at the end with PCT IMO works the best...once OFF...it also makes more sense.
    P
    ...my thoughts exactly

  5. #25
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    Here is a post by Dave Palumbo.
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    Q: I have seen a lot of conflicting views on using HCG while cycling and during PCT. The most common route nowadays on various well known boards is to use HCG for the entire cycle starting about 1-2 weeks in (depending upon what esters you are using, for example if you are using enanthate, start in week 2, prop would be in about 3-4 days) @ about 500-600iu per week and continuing this through PCT. Would using HCG for this long period of time, for multiple cycles, lead one to not respond to it as well each time? I know you advocate 2000iu e3d for a total of 5 shots post cycle, and by using it throughout the entire cycle seems like a bad idea to me in the long run, and I like your idea a lot more. Just wanted to know what the good and/or bad effects it has using it throughout the whole cycle

    A: Using HCG during your cycle is a waste of money. If you are adding exogenous testosterone, you are going to suppress your natural test production. As long as you keep taking in testosterone (or other steroids) your natural production will shut down and while HCG might stimulate testosterone production, it won't do anything (it's such a small amount). HCG works post-cycle because you're off testosterone....it's like jump starting your dead car battery. If you take it on-cycle, you get the jump start and your body immediately sees it doesn't need to produce test and turns back off.
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  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Praetorian View Post
    Here is a post by Dave Palumbo.
    P

    Q: I have seen a lot of conflicting views on using HCG while cycling and during PCT. The most common route nowadays on various well known boards is to use HCG for the entire cycle starting about 1-2 weeks in (depending upon what esters you are using, for example if you are using enanthate, start in week 2, prop would be in about 3-4 days) @ about 500-600iu per week and continuing this through PCT. Would using HCG for this long period of time, for multiple cycles, lead one to not respond to it as well each time? I know you advocate 2000iu e3d for a total of 5 shots post cycle, and by using it throughout the entire cycle seems like a bad idea to me in the long run, and I like your idea a lot more. Just wanted to know what the good and/or bad effects it has using it throughout the whole cycle

    A: Using HCG during your cycle is a waste of money. If you are adding exogenous testosterone, you are going to suppress your natural test production. As long as you keep taking in testosterone (or other steroids) your natural production will shut down and while HCG might stimulate testosterone production, it won't do anything (it's such a small amount). HCG works post-cycle because you're off testosterone....it's like jump starting your dead car battery. If you take it on-cycle, you get the jump start and your body immediately sees it doesn't need to produce test and turns back off.
    Nicole Ball and I chatted with Dave in July for her leg training video Nicole Ball/youtube) . I also had asked him a few questions and one was very similar to your post....smart dude!

    .......Nic and I both use Species sups
    Last edited by GYMBRAT; 16-09-2010 at 12:15 PM.

  7. #27
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    couple of points I'll add to this... HCG can be usefull on a long cycle to maintain an rehabilitate your nut sack if you were on a previous long cycle prior and didn't use any ... that's my own personal finding.

    While coming off when using aromatase inhibitors such as femara and arimidex you have to be carefull to wean off these... ie. taper off them as they are so strong they can actually eliminate all estrogen from your body, which effectively hyper-sensitizes your estrogen receptors.

    Then once off the AI's any estrogen produced by your body even within normal amounts can cause things like gyno, suppression, mood swings etc.

    Aromasin is a better choice IMO

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prisoner#22 View Post
    couple of points I'll add to this... HCG can be usefull on a long cycle to maintain an rehabilitate your nut sack if you were on a previous long cycle prior and didn't use any ... that's my own personal finding.

    While coming off when using aromatase inhibitors such as femara and arimidex you have to be carefull to wean off these... ie. taper off them as they are so strong they can actually eliminate all estrogen from your body, which effectively hyper-sensitizes your estrogen receptors.

    Then once off the AI's any estrogen produced by your body even within normal amounts can cause things like gyno, suppression, mood swings etc.

    Aromasin is a better choice IMO
    I would say Aromasin is the standard today.
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  9. #29
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    HCG on cycle as other benefits than keep the boys fat. I run 500 iu 2x EW & for the day after each shot, I have feel like I've taken an aphrodisiac. For some that may not be a reason to use HCG on cycle, but for me, it's just fun that I anticipate after each shot.

    Solo

  10. #30
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    i was doing a bit of reading tonight on HCG on this site and others. I started off with the profiles - This was what I found before finding this thread. So I'm confused as this says to take it ON a cycle and NOT of PCT , while you all are saying the oposite.

    It is important to note that HCG should only be run while a user is still on cycle and not during PCT. This is due to human chorionic gonadotropin actually being suppressive to the hypothalamus pituitary testes axis. Obviously this is something to be avoided when attempting to "re-start" your natural testosterone production. Ensure that the last shot of HCG is taken within several days of the start time of post-cycle therapy so that it has cleared the system of the user and the compounds being taken for PCT can function as intended.
    Last edited by Talo; 26-04-2011 at 02:14 AM.


 
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