CANADA BODYBUILDING - CANADIAN BODYBUILDING FORUM
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 22
  1. #11
    National Level Bodybuilder
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    5,678
    Rep Power
    25

    Default

    All I am saying is if building muscle and body composition is your goal than running is counter productive to that goal. Remember running is the antithesis to building muscle and unfortunately there is no getting around that unless you change the type of running you are doing ie sprinting instead of steady state cardio. There are many article and studies showing the negative affects associated with steady state cardio. The other issue is running is actually not ideal for cardio. MMA athletes have known this for years and that's why they choose many other alternatives that are much more efficient without the negative sides of steady state cardio.
    I know many a runner and I have always supported there running because of what they get out of it at an emotional level however I do try to convince them to do some resistance training so it offsets the issues associated with running. But again they are runners and their goals are much different. If you are a bodybuilder or interested in building muscle efficiently I would choose the more effective efficient methods.

    P
    BodyAthletica has teamed up with Canadian Protein.com!
    **Use link http://canadianprotein.refr.cc/5D9LJ57 *free shipping on orders over $99l!*
    **Visit www.bodyathletica.com and www.canadianprotein.com**

  2. #12
    Twirp
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    10
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    @Praetorian Thanks again for the insight. I know what you mean about state cardio and as Steve mentioned if I run it's for about 30min max and not every week. But there are definitely other things I can and will have to do as it gets colder.

    On another note I've changed my macros around so that I'm hitting 50% protein 30-35 % Carb and 15-20% Carb and this seems to be working great. A little loss of strength in some areas but the body composition is definitely changing which is what I want.

    If my total weight is 215lbs and I'm still taking in roughly 300gr of protein and 100-150gr carbs can I still gain lean muscle?

  3. #13
    Twirp
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    10
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    @ admin How come it takes sooo long for my posts to show up?? ( like 4-5 days)

    Thanks again Praetorian.

    I'm not that big of a runner so I don't think it should be an issue.

    I seem to be building a decent amount of muscle as my weight is not budging yet I seem to be slimming down since I've changed my macros. I've cut my carbs to 100-150gr / increased my fats to 100-110gr and kept my protein at around 300-340gr a day. I have to say my strength has gone down some which is frustrating but not as much as the stubborn fat I can't seem to lose.

    What kind of cardio do you recommend Praetorian?
    Last edited by nomaadic13; 25-08-2014 at 10:44 AM. Reason: Test

  4. #14
    Super Moderator
    National Level Bodybuilder

    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    1,897
    Rep Power
    16

    Default

    I'm a fan of steady state cardio for bodybuilding purposes on a strict calorie restricted diet (ie- prepping for a show / final weeks). Any study that contradicts its benefit, I'm sure may have some merit, although I've yet to find anything to convince me otherwise. For me the goal is to burn calories. it depends alot on what you're eating and how you're feeling. Different kinds of cardio will be optimal for different types of people for a whole bunch of different reasons. It's once again why I have a hard time being convinced on a study related to nutrition / exercise. Studies related to pretty much ANYTHING is all about the masses, and not about the individual. All any good study aims to show is that on average, there is an increase in a mean (or percentage) of a group of individuals relative to another for some measure. I've just published another related to weight loss in children in JAMA related to types of exercise in a focused group of obese adolescents. It's a good example to bring up, because the conclusion might say 1 thing, but it does not mean that had everyone in the study been part of that group, there results would have been better. It just means on average it may be the case.

    If one focuses too much on all the studies, you'll either get your head tied up in knots because of the contradictions (especially in this science) or you will be focused on doing certain things for only marginal benefits. ex. would you eat something that tasted like shit everyday if you thought it might help you lose on average 0.1 pounds more bodyfat over 12 weeks than something else that taste awesome?

    For someone not competing and who has tuns of energy in their diet, I am a fan of high intensity cardio - and not necessary intervals, but either one is great. It also depends when you do it, what you've eaten in the past few hours and what your goals are. As an ex-cyclist, my glycogen stores were always pretty full, as I was always eating a good amount. I could wake up, eat a nutri grain bar and bike 100km in 3 hours any day of the week. As a bodybuilder in show prep mode, I could not get 5 km without hitting the wall.

    Without turning this into a large debate about cardio types, because honestly, I will agree that they all are good, and most do not have clincically relevant benefits (in terms of muscle loss, fat loss given similar energy expenditure) - I would recommend doing the cardio that you have the most fun with. Whatever is most sustainable - least boring, and allows you to do it. If that means something different each day, then so be it.

  5. #15
    Super Moderator
    National Level Bodybuilder

    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    1,897
    Rep Power
    16

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by nomaadic13 View Post

    I seem to be building a decent amount of muscle as my weight is not budging yet I seem to be slimming down since I've changed my macros. I've cut my carbs to 100-150gr / increased my fats to 100-110gr and kept my protein at around 300-340gr a day. I have to say my strength has gone down some which is frustrating but not as much as the stubborn fat I can't seem to lose.
    Sounds like you're doing things right. Weight not budging, but slimming down is key. I would do that for a month and if things stall, then drop your calories a bit further. You could easily drop the protein a bit as I don't think you need 300+ grams a day for your purposes. It sounds like about 2750-3000 calories at this point, and with a decent amount of activity, you should continue to drop. I wouldn't worry too much about strength. Some things will drop because you lose size. The saying in powerlifting goes 'mass moves mass'. If you drop even some fat, the strength can drop. Some lifts aren't as affected as much as others you might notice. You also may do better with a bit more carbs in your diet with a little less protein. That is just an option for later if you don't like the current diet. If things get difficult diet wise, that is when you're doing things wrong. If you feel like you can't keep the diet up long term (ie, start getting moody, start dreaming about food, feel lethargic often) then the diet is going to be unsustainable - unless you just looking to get in shape for a specific day/period -(which is fine too if that's your goal)

  6. #16
    Super Moderator
    National Level Bodybuilder

    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    1,897
    Rep Power
    16

    Default

    PS: For the record, I don't enjoy running, and wouldn't recommend it either unless its what they enjoy or are good at. Some people just love to run. Others do it because they think its the key to fat loss. If one is running not because they love it, then YES, I would for sure pick something else over running if the goal was to keep size. From experience though, the main reason would be not related to the type of cardio - but because of how it might affect training (which I suppose relates to how easy or hard it is on your joints). Running is the easiest way to ruin a good leg day in the gym for me. Even cycling was hard on leg days (less than running). In fact, personally I don't do any cardio for fatloss. The less I do, the more energy I have elsewhere (ie for weights). Not saying that's the case for everyone - some people must do cardio if they expect to get shredded. Others do not. Cardio for me is for cardiovascular health rather than fatloss.

  7. #17
    National Level Bodybuilder
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    5,678
    Rep Power
    25

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by nomaadic13 View Post
    @ admin How come it takes sooo long for my posts to show up?? ( like 4-5 days)

    Thanks again Praetorian.

    I'm not that big of a runner so I don't think it should be an issue.

    I seem to be building a decent amount of muscle as my weight is not budging yet I seem to be slimming down since I've changed my macros. I've cut my carbs to 100-150gr / increased my fats to 100-110gr and kept my protein at around 300-340gr a day. I have to say my strength has gone down some which is frustrating but not as much as the stubborn fat I can't seem to lose.

    What kind of cardio do you recommend Praetorian?
    My recommendation for cardio is dependent on your diet. I believe the best type of cardio for most people is simply walking. I do not count walking as steady state cardio...that would include running, stairclimber etc. Walking has many benefits besides burning fat i also improves digestion and aids in recovery...you cant go wrong. On the other end of the spectrum is HIT cardio ie hill sprints, sled pulling or pushing, etc.
    Keep in mind however these activities are more taxing on your recovery ability which is why walking is my first suggestion.

    P
    BodyAthletica has teamed up with Canadian Protein.com!
    **Use link http://canadianprotein.refr.cc/5D9LJ57 *free shipping on orders over $99l!*
    **Visit www.bodyathletica.com and www.canadianprotein.com**

  8. #18
    Twirp
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    10
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    Wow thanks Steve, that was some great information and also corroborates the feelings I've had about studies. I used to lift for the fun of it and now since getting back into it I'm trying to take a more methodical approach however as you mentioned it can get quite overwhelming when delving into the scientific aspects of it. I have so many particularities and my body has changed and reacts much differently now that I'm in my 30's so I've come to understand that first I need to really understand my body.
    Since I'm not competing, at least not this year as the Nati comp has passed from what I've been told I also think HIIT cardio would probably be best for me since I like to change things up and trained that way when I played Basketball and soccer. I don't love running by any means but I like the outdoors so I can sacrifice running to keep muscle and my joints! lol
    You're spot on with the calories as it falls between 2700-3000 as you mentioned. For some reason I've become a protein head and have this fear that if I drop below 300gr I'll lose some muscle but I'm sure that's totally unwarranted. I increased my carbs a bit so I'm closer to 200gr as of last week seeing that I ended up getting these cravings mid week and would end up having a least one cheat meal a week which I don't know is good really.
    I totally understand when you say mass moved mass and I gather I am in need of some more carbs if my weight isn't changing yet I'm lifting . Especially now as I've started a program for the first time and it lasts 8 weeks. 6 days on and one off but the most taxing part is the 45sec rests between sets which I've never done and can certainly feel. Plus I started working out at 6am now instead of after work so I'm able to have more carbs in the morning now.
    Btw that's damm impressive doing a 100km bike ride on a nutri grain bar.

    Great basic suggestion Praetorian, walking certainly does have many benefits and with all the sitting and driving I do I should do more of it. Thanks!
    Last edited by nomaadic13; 02-09-2014 at 01:47 PM.

  9. #19
    Super Moderator
    National Level Bodybuilder

    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    1,897
    Rep Power
    16

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by nomaadic13 View Post
    Btw that's damm impressive doing a 100km bike ride on a nutri grain bar.
    Thank goodness for glycogen...

    As for protein - you don't need 300g each and everyday, although it doesn't necessarily hurt you! Carbs are also 'muscle-sparing'. Many opinions to proper nutrition. My advice always relates around not complicating things too much. People get way too carried away with the science behind nutrition. Science and logic can back up many things. But in the end, I like to see the numbers. IE - had you done everything the same but switched out 50 grams of protein for 50 grams of carbs, where would that leave you? probably not much difference.

    Whatever is most realistic for the individual is the best way to go. For some that means being extremely meticulous and doing things 100% by the books. For others, that approach can be stressful and lead to failure. Neither is wrong - its just whatever is most realistic for your own goals.

  10. #20
    Twirp
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    10
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    Great wisdom Steve! Thanks again


 
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. anyone have insight?
    By phatkid77 in forum CBBF - Canadian Bodybuilding Federation
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 05-09-2011, 11:28 PM
  2. Need some insight...I'm at a crossroad.
    By chan_ho_nam in forum Relationships
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 20-03-2011, 07:44 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •